panel item remove confirmation

[Brian J. Tarricone]

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Fabian Nowak wrote:
> Am Montag, den 17.10.2005, 01:54 -0700 schrieb Brian J. Tarricone:
> 
>>Fabian Nowak wrote:
>>
>>>Am Sonntag, den 16.10.2005, 23:47 -0700 schrieb Brian J. Tarricone:
>>>
>>
>>>this is what happened already several times to me and
>>>AFAIK jasper, too.
>>>having the dialog removed already prevented me two times from removing
>>>the panel accidentaly as the dialog comes unexpected and therefor i read
>>>it.
>>
>>This really doesn't make sense to me.  It sounds like you're just being
>>too hasty.
> 
> yes, i am. but others are, too. especially when you're porting plugins,
> developing new ones or such work - "remove" and "remove" doesn't differ
> too much when you're just searching for "remove".

I'm starting to feel like this argument here is just a bit absurd.
Basically your position is that you're too hasty to read a dialog box to
differentiate it between a confirmation for "remove item" and "remove
panel", so you'd rather have no dialog box for "remove item" at all to
reduce the chances of accidentally confirming a "remove panel" dialog.
Seriously, am I the only one that finds this a bit strange?

>>>but restoring one's old panel is much more work than restoring a simple
>>>plugin, since sensors-plugin is configured in 15-30 seconds and even the
>>>mailwatch-plugin is so straight forward that you won't probably take
>>>more than 2 minutes for 4 accounts, at least that's what it took me.
>>
>>Um, and you think 2 minutes is an acceptable amount of time to recover
>>from a clear dataloss scenario?  I don't.  And two minutes is pretty
>>optimistic, especially if you want to set multiple IMAP new mail folders
>>on multiple accounts, as is the case with me.
> 
> 2 minutes is ok, a panel config takes up to an hour. perhaps i'll just
> create a backup of my panel config which i can restore then :-/

Yes.  If you're so concerned about losing your panel config *due to user
error*, then yes, you should back it up.  Backups make sense for larger
bits of data (full panel config); the program attempting to protect the
user from himself is easiest for smaller bits of data (single item config).

>>>what about having a panel option "show remove confirmation on plugin
>>>removal" which might be enabled by default, thus enabling me and perhaps
>>>many others to not have this dialog.
>>
>>Do you *really* add and remove plugins from the panel so often that a
>>dialog is that annoying?  If so, I'm sure you're in the small minority.
> 
> as above, yes when developing or improving or porting plugins.

You're proving my point.  As a developer or improver of plugins, you're
in the small minority.

>> A pref here is bloat.  IMO the dialog should come back and there should
>>be no pref for it.
> 
> have an option in panel.xml then.

It's a fallacy that hidden options involve less bloat than visible
options.  UI bloat != code bloat.  As a programmer yourself, you should
know that.  A pref like this contributes to code bloat.  Making it a
visible pref would add UI bloat on top of that.

>>Perhaps someone with some actual HCI design credentials would like to
>>weigh in on this issue (Erik, I'm looking at you).
> 
> well, that's just me. sorry *g*
> 
> "make similar things similiar. and unsimilar things unsimilar." 
> this is what's being hurt when having two very similar dialogs for very
> different actions.
> 
> very different images showing an example panel or an example plugin in
> the dialog would help improve this.
> 
> another hci guideline is to code further information, i.e. if you have
> those two "remove" entries, one should be blue and the other gree, e.g.
> of course, nonone wants green and blue and ... menus.
> 
> another idea might be to differnetiate between removing a panel item and
> deleting the whole panel in the menu, thus distinguishing more.

Or we can go for something in between the orignal menu and what we have.
 Perhaps "Remove Item" and "Remove Panel"?  Still, we're straying from
the original matter: the dataloss bug when there's no item remove
confirmation dialog.

I see Jannis mentioned a "Don't ask me again"-type dialog, which I like,
but it breaks the usual behavior a bit.  Usually they imply "... and do
what I did this time from now on".  But of course, checking it and then
clicking "cancel" is absurd: then you can never remove panel items.
Ever.  I'm not saying we can't change the behavior... just that I
dislike breaking accepted behaviors.  But I don't feel too strongly
about it.

Meanwhile, Jasper, why aren't there icons in the panel menu?
GTK_STOCK_ADD, GTK_STOCK_REMOVE, GTK_STOCK_NEW, GTK_STOCK_PREFERENCES,
etc. etc.

	-brian
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